#048 The Accidental Entrepreneur | Carmel Peinke

Carmel Peinke, guest · [01:41]You mentioned earlier that I got my slot into the FMCG industry purely by chance, and when I tell you that's the truth, it's the God's honest truth. I was working with the most amazing lady. I was working in the automotive industry, and I had the most amazing lady who was my recruitment agent. And she called me up one day and she said, I've got the perfect job for you. And I said to her, Estelle, I'm not really in the market for a job because I really did love my job. And she said, no, no, I need you to meet this executive at Smollan. Please send me your updated CV, which I duly did. He saw my CV, he was a bit underwhelmed because I knew nothing about the FMCG industry. I was like, why would I apply for a senior position in the FMCG industry when I know nothing about it? She eventually bullied us to just have a cup of coffee. And I went through a very rigorous recruitment process. the person that I was replacing really supported me. She paid it forward. She spent weekends with me explaining the industry. I got to put together what I think to this day was an incredible presentation and I landed the job. So that was me in Smollan, launching new brands, and I walked into a team that was literally launching Lipton Iced Tea in this country, and it was all the experiential brand building. So it was getting parasols placed, it was getting the product listed on menu, it was getting people to sample, it was running competitions, it was doing fun mixes with products, just a whole lot of real brand awareness. And every Friday in those days, Unilever, Unilever still owned Lipton Iced Tea, but every Friday I had a meeting with Unilever to explain how sales performance was going.

Carmel Peinke, guest · [03:16]And it was a, it was an absolute fly by the seat of our pants, you know, how many stores have sold how many cases of Lipton Iced Tea, and we honestly didn't

Carmel Peinke, guest · [03:25]know. So I was by chance explaining this challenge to a friend of mine one day, and he was a techie, and he said, Carmel, let's work together on this. And I specced the application. His team developed it. We had a one-year proof of concept with the Ceres Beverage Company, because in that year, Lipton Iced Tea moved over to being manufactured by Ceres, what was then the Ceres Beverage Company. One-year proof of concept, and 17 years down the line, they still had light. Under their new face, Pioneer Foods. But yeah, and then from there, it's just really been word of mouth.

Petro du Pisani, host · [08:49]So what is the biggest barriers you've had to face in this whole journey of learning and how did you overcome them?

Carmel Peinke, guest · [08:58]I think probably my biggest barrier has been myself. And it's, it's been a lack of confidence. to this day, when, when I show people, so we've now got three applications, three front-end applications, mobile applications, and we're now working with AI. And to this day, when somebody goes, oh my gosh, that's amazing, I'm blown away. Every time. So I hope I never lose that actually, because it's a genuine appreciation then for what we do. But that has been a stumbling block for me because it's meant that I potentially haven't gone after the big fish as soon as I should have. Or maybe I needed more experience, and only now we can really go after the big, big fish. I'll, I'll tell you why I say, why I think it was a stumbling block. There was a, there is a man who started a similar business. We were first to market, so that was just like, wow. And in fact, our very first client paid us for three years of exclusivity in their categories. So we could talk to anybody else if they had different categories, but not in their categories. There's a man in the industry who started a similar business about a year after me, but he started it in Africa. He is South African, started it up there, and then came back here. And he subsequently sold his business for an insane amount of money. And I just realize that that's the difference between a man's confidence. They just, they don't have that doubt thing. They just go for the target that I deviate left or right. Whereas I have sat On a rock every now and again, sort of, am I doing the right thing? Is this right? Are we really solving a real world problem? Is this enough? That's what I say, biggest stumbling block has definitely been me.

Petro du Pisani, host · [10:52]So what helps you to get over that self-doubt and keep going?

Carmel Peinke, guest · [10:57]Sometimes I need to sit myself down and have a real chat with myself. You know, first thing in the morning before, you know, as the sun's coming up, it's just to, what is my list of priorities for the day? What are the big rock issues that, or what are the big clients I need to land in the next month or the next quarter? You know, where do I want to go? And what do I need to do today? What small step do I need to take, do today to bring me one step closer to that? And I think it's taking those moments of self-talk. Just stopping at the blank piece of paper, all my notes are in here, blank piece of paper and just jotting down what's important. How am I going to get there? What do I need to do? I think that, I think that helps me tremendously. Doesn't mean I stop feeling the lack of confidence, but it just, it makes, it creates structure for me.

Petro du Pisani, host · [11:46]So

Carmel Peinke, guest · [11:46]I've got a little roadmap, and then I can go.

Petro du Pisani, host · [13:28]It sounds like this business is very sort of relationship based. If you've built a good relationship, then people will keep using your business. So how important has that been to like network and build relationships?

Carmel Peinke, guest · [13:43]It's been crucial. Like our product has to stand the test of time and it's got to be stable. It can never fall over. You know, all of those things that actually should be a bare minimum in a, a software or a software as a service or software as a platform environment. The relationships will open the doors. I've just been on a conference Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday, with one of the petroleum companies and all of the suppliers and all of the route to market partners were there. And it was just the going to go and greet somebody you know and in walking into that group going, oh, you must meet so and so. And it's having that warmth. That's where it's been good to be a woman, that you can walk in and hug somebody hello and just like be genuinely pleased to see them. Immediately introduce me. You must come and see so and so. You know, meet our new MD. It's like, oh, this is great. Hi, I'm so embarrassed that I haven't met you yet. So, the relationship thing has definitely worked.

Petro du Pisani, host · [14:36]Yeah, so I get a lot of questions from my coaching clients about how do I build my network and how do I do networking and how do I break into a new market? so do you have any tips around how to do that?

Carmel Peinke, guest · [14:50]It's so interesting you ask me that question right now because that's one of the little rocks I'm sitting on. And you know, you do it exactly the same way you did the first time. You pick up the phone and you say, can I come and have a cup of coffee with you? I don't want to sell you anything. I actually just want to ask you some questions. I would like you to help me understand the industry a bit better, please. And if it's relevant, I'd like to see if our services can help you.

Petro du Pisani, host · [15:13]Yeah. I sort of think that the best way to network or to build a network is through curiosity, is to just be 100% curious about the business, about how they made it work for them, what they did to be successful, you know, and just to see if anything aligns. 100%. Yeah.

Carmel Peinke, guest · [15:33]Yeah. Because if you, to that point exactly, if you're, if you're approaching it with the curiosity, as you mentioned, then you're getting more answers than questions, and you will walk away from that meeting knowing whether this channel is actually going to work for you or not.

Carmel Peinke, guest · [15:49]Yeah.

Carmel Peinke, guest · [15:49]Not you as a person, your service offering. Because if you've asked enough questions of the first person you encounter, they'll tell you enough for you to know.

Carmel Peinke, guest · [16:21]I prefer a collaborative leadership style. I guess, actually, I'm a bit of a mixed bag because collabora, I don't believe I'm the knower of all things. I do not have the answers to all questions, and I firmly believe the more brains you throw at a problem, the better your solution's going to be. I am driven for client delight, though. So we can collaborate all we like. If, if we are not delighting the client, the collaboration stops, because without them, we don't exist. So, that's something, and over the years, That has served me well, and it's not served me well, because people, so, you're a woman, and oftentimes people that don't know you will then think, when you start engaging, when they start their employment journey, they're like, oh, she's quite relaxed. And it's almost a fundamental human failing that, okay, I see she's quite relaxed, so I'll just... And the crazy thing is, as a woman, you also feel it intuitively, and then, and then the minute I feel something's off, then I start checking outcomes, and I'm like, we've got a problem here. And then I get fiercely cheeky,

Petro du Pisani, host · [17:28]which

Carmel Peinke, guest · [17:29]is so unnecessary. I get downright savage. And I guess I was that, I was probably a harder leader at Smollan, because it's an incredibly hard business, but they also, they drive excellence. There, you can breathe and you can have excellence, and those are the only two things that occupy your day. also client delight, and they want performance, the end. and then when I transitioned into my business, I think I've kept a lot of that. And I was also very fortunate at Smollan in that, so I reported into a man who reported directly into, in those days, Doug Smollan, and he gave me carte blanche. He said to me, Carmel, here's the mandate. This is the earnings that you need to achieve. This is, you know, the turnover I would recommend to get that. This is where you're going. If You have to excuse my tone of phrase, but this is literally what he said. He said, if the shit hits the fan, phone me. Otherwise, just go and get it. So that was really good for me. He just left me alone. I was responsible and accountable.

Petro du Pisani, host · [18:39]Yeah.

Carmel Peinke, guest · [18:40]so it was quite easy then for me to migrate over.

Petro du Pisani, host · [18:45]Another thing that I, I, I see a lot of women grappling with, as they go up the leadership chain to, to higher and higher levels is how do I do that, but still maintain my own sense of self and my own sense of authority and integrity, you know? Cause it's, it's almost like in some companies you have to mold yourself to that company and become like a representative of that company to get anywhere. So how do you go up the leadership ladder while still being true to yourself?

Carmel Peinke, guest · [19:17]And maintaining your femininity.

Petro du Pisani, host · [19:19]Yeah, and, and that as well. Yes.

Carmel Peinke, guest · [19:21]You've just. Shaking me up with that thinking, because as much as I absolutely loved where I was, because it was such a hard male-dominated world, I was expected to be a very hard leader in terms of driving outcomes, driving performance. and actually, if I, if I have to really dig deep, I probably, I mean, I could have wandered over to the IT guys, I knew them, to take my idea to Smollan. I actually was being tested at exactly that point in time. my line manager had changed, and, and I was being tested on exactly the points you make. And I remember driving home one day, talking to myself out loud, cause I do do that, and saying to myself, cause I'd lost my temper. And I got into my car on the way home, and I said, who the hell are you? Who are you becoming? And I didn't like it. And as much as he was only one aspect of my life, I was clearly starting to face that very thing. And I've actually never thought about that before. Because for me, the next thing was just moving into getting E-Route to Market off the ground. And then that guy moved into another portfolio and somebody else came in who was like quite relaxed with me and said, like, Carmel, we just need you to stick around for another three months. We, we don't. And then it was three, I had an 11-month notice period by the end of it. But I was coming into the office, but doing what I needed to, to get E-Route to Market going. And it was everybody was on board with it. But I hadn't actually thought about that. I was being tested on that very thing to maintain my integrity, to, I'm a woman. And, and he was challenging exactly that. Just by pushing me, I mean, he, he wasn't doing anything untoward, but just by pushing, pushing me to display more masculine attributes. Yeah, I've actually never thought about it like that.

Carmel Peinke, guest · [27:46]That it is not a one size fits all. I believe you have to keep your core values and your core self in check, you know, in place, not in check, in place. And I think to be an authentic leader, the person you are at home must be the person you are at work. And I don't mean for me, the person with no makeup and threatening to show my head bald just now, my characteristics must be the same. If at home, I'm a neat freak and in the office, I'm going to be a neat freak. If at home, you know, just in terms of keeping yourself, authentic, you can't be two different people because I think people, others can pick up on that and then mistrust comes in and all sorts of things. So I think you have to be as authentic as possible while keeping your eye on the ball, while being aware of the competitor landscape, while being aware of the fact that you're actually just a mom to a bunch of big adults when you're actually, to a bunch of five-year-olds housed in big adult bodies, when you're actually a five-year-old housed in an adult body too. So you're kind of corolling kids on a playground to try and get them to work together. And it's, and I don't mean to sound flippant or disrespectful. I'm just like, I, I do believe we're all five-year-olds trapped in a huge big body. So, you know, how do you engage with the different personalities and get the personalities to engage with each other for the best?